On Sat, Feb 15, 2014 at 05:21:11PM +0100, Arnd Bergmann wrote:

On Saturday 15 February 2014 14:22:30 Tomasz Figa wrote:

quoted

On 15.02.2014 14:09, Arnd Bergmann wrote:

quoted

For spi-mode SDIO devices I'm assuming it's similar, except that
you'd describe the actual SDIO device in the board info rather than
create a fake SDIO controller. Still not discoverable unless I'm
missing your point.

I'm not sure if we should assume that SPI = MMC over SPI. I believe 
there might be a custom protocol involved as well.

In case of SD/MMC, you essentially have three separate command sets:
SPI, MMC and SD, and each of them has multiple versions. MMC and SD
compatible devices generally also support the SPI command set (IIRC
it is required,

SPI support is mandatory for SDIO as well.

SDIO has CIS (remember card information structures... like PCMCIA)
which identifies the various different logical functions of the device,
giving class information, vendor information etc.

So... certainly the type of the attached device is discoverable even
on SPI.

If a device supports both SDIO and SPI, I think a straightforward
implementation would be to use the exact same command set, but
you are right that this isn't the only possibility, and the SD/MMC
shows how they can be slightly different already.

Given that the SPI mode is mandatory for SDIO cards, why would you
also implement another SPI mode with different commands?

quoted

Stepping aside from SPI, I already gave an example of a WLAN chip that 
supports multiple control busses [1]. In addition to the commonly used 
SDIO, it supports USB and HSIC as well:

[1] http://www.marvell.com/wireless/assets/marvell_avastar_88w8797.pdf

Moreover, some of Samsung boards use HSIC to communicate with modem 
chips, which have exactly the same problem as we're trying to solve here 
- they need to be powered on to be discovered.

Thanks, this definitely makes a good example. I see that it also
supports SPI mode for SDIO as mentioned in your link.

Well, USB is another discoverable bus.  As HSIC is a derivative of USB,
I'd be surprised if it weren't discoverable there too.

So, out of everything identified so far, we have no undiscoverable buses.

Agreed. Putting the same chip on USB or HSIC has the exact same
requirements, since we also have a discoverable bus, but actually
finding the device likely involves some power-on sequencing before
the bus controller can find it.

That's partly the nature of integrating something onto a board where you
want maximal power savings.  It's basically that dreaded word which
software people seem to hate: "embedded".

* Arnd's proposal (change bus code to probe nonstandard devices
  from DT if we can't easily detect them):
  + Matches what we already do for PCI (at least on powerpc)
    and AMBA/Primecell devices: If a device can't be probed
    using the standard method, we treat it as nondiscoverable
    and describe it using DT.
  + Devices can have arbitrary complex requirements without
    impacting the core, since all code is contained in the
    driver for the nonstandard device.
  + Properties that are required for probing and runtime
    configuration only have to be set once (e.g. you may
    need clk_get() for probing and clk_set_rate() for
    runtime-pm).
  + Devices that have alternative bus interfaces like 88w8797
    can implement the power-on code in a central place per
    driver, and can reuse the code they have for nondiscoverable
    buses on the buses that are normally discoverable but
    broken here.
  - Still need to modify each subsystem to have alternate
    ways of probing, and match up devices later.
  - Has to be implemented in each driver that needs it, making
    it harder to share code for drivers with the same need
    (e.g. every device that just needs an external reset
    trigger).

 - requires different DT if the chip is changed, which causes problems
   for users to identify which out of zillions of DT files they should
   use for their exact platform.
 - have to work out how to match up the fake device with a probed device
   when it becomes available: existing SDIO drivers all assume that the
   card has been through a fairly complex initialisation sequence already.
 - multi-function SDIO is much harder to deal with since you have mutliple
   drivers involved, and the SDIO device as a whole needs initialisation
   before anyone can drive it.
 - adds complexity to the SDIO drivers; they would have to know whether
   they're embedded or on a plug-in card.

-- 
FTTC broadband for 0.8mile line: 5.8Mbps down 500kbps up.  Estimation
in database were 13.1 to 19Mbit for a good line, about 7.5+ for a bad.
Estimate before purchase was "up to 13.2Mbit".