On Sat, 07 Jul 2007 14:54:11 -0700
"Kok, Auke" [off-list ref] wrote:

Francois Romieu wrote:

quoted

Kok, Auke [off-list ref] :

quoted

Jeff Garzik wrote:

quoted

Kok, Auke wrote:

[...]

quoted

This is not acceptable and hardly fair to expect from us.

It also exposes users to endless delays and uncertainties as to a final 
resolution. Not to mention that writing a driver from scratch for (just) 
ich9 will take significant time, is silly since it's almost identical to 
ich8 etc..

I don't think that anyone besides you and maybe one or two others are 
interested in doing this rewrite from scratch.

So far I'd say him and at least two others. Is it time to count them ?

Everybody is cool and polite but after a week of discussion this is
going nowhere.

It is really hard to stay polite for me now. After we were told to clean up the 
driver and implement things like feature flags and organize all the various 
hardware dependent bits, we did exactly that. And now we're told to rewrite the 
driver from scratch. ("thanks for the effort but no thanks, do this instead").

If that does not make your hair on the back of your neck stand up...

I politely suggested a middle way that would allows us to continue working on 
the driver and take it to the next step. This would in my opinion be the least 
destructive plan and get us moving forward quickly. Jeff's alternative plan can 
set us back another year. Perhaps it won't, but I fear that it will, and it will 
  be a hard thing to sell to my group and other parties.

I agree that rewriting drivers that are bad from scratch is a good thing. But in 
this case we're talking about a driver with a good reputation that has 
functioned really well for everyone for as long as it's out there. Perhaps you 
disagree on this, but lets just agree on that e1000 never really broke in the 
last 7 years even though we added over 50 different type of adapters to it, and 
it's still performance wise a good driver.

As a matter of fact, I find it hard to believe that e1000 has a bad reputation. 
Almost all of the direct feedback that I get from people using e1000 is 
positive. We regularly get good feedback on our response rate too.

We as a group are committed to keep repairing and improving e1000 and I think 
that we have shown our good intent with some of the stuff that we've recently 
shown. I think it's also polite to let us do our work and work *with* us, 
instead of dumping our ideas ("I like the gist of it, but") and basically 
sending us off with nothing. And that means that the linux community also is 
stuck with nothing.

I would really like to continue with my original plan that I posted that follows 
Christoph's idea. I hope you can all agree with that so we can get on with this.

I think rather than having a meta-discussion, which always seems to degenerate
into finger pointing. Let's look at the code. The problem with popular drivers
(as I too well know) is that user's seem to find every wart.  There are lots of
old drivers that never seem to get the same scrutiny, and if they did would
be tarred and feathered.

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