On Wed, 5 Jan 2000, Peter J. Braam wrote:

I think I mean joining.  What I need is:
  
 braam starts trans
   does A
   calls reiser: hans starts
   does B
   hans commits; nothing goes to disk yet
   braam does C
braam commits/aborts ABC now go or don't

Reiserfs won't do this kind of nesting right now, we also don't have a
transaction abort (aside from crashing the machine).  These can be added
to a future version, but would you mind explaining your transaction needs
in more detail (offline) so I can get a better idea of what you are
looking for?

-chris

- Peter -

On Wed, 5 Jan 2000, Hans Reiser wrote:

quoted

Is nesting really the term you mean to use here, or is joining the term you
mean?

Do you really mean transactions within other transactions?

Exactly what functionality do you need?

Hans

"Peter J. Braam" wrote:

quoted

Hi,

I have one request for the journal API for use by network file systems -
it is a request of a slightly different nature than the ones discussed so
far.

InterMezzo (www.inter-mezzo.org) exploits an existing disk file system as
a cache and wraps around it. (Any disk file system can be used, but so far
only Ext2 has been exploited.)  High availability file systems need update
logs of changes that were made to the cache so that these may be
propagated to peers when they come back online (to support "disconnected
operation").

Requested feature:
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Stephen's journal API has a tremendously useful feature: it allows nesting
of transactions.   I don't know if Reiser has this (can you tell me
Chris?) but it is _incredibly_ useful.  So:

- InterMezzo can start a journal transaction
 - execute the underlying Ext3 routine within that transaction
   (i.e. the Ext3 transaction becomes part of the one started
    by InterMezzo)
- InterMezzo finishes its routine (e.g. by noting that an update
took place in its update log) and commits or aborts the transaction

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

[So, in particular InterMezzo and Ext3 share the journal transaction log.]

Why is this useful? There are at least two reasons:

 - the update InterMezzo update log can be kept in sync with the Ext3 file
system as a cache

 - InterMezzo will soon manage somewhat more metadata (e.g. it may want to
remmeber a global file identifier, similar to a Coda FID or NFS file
handle) and it can make updates to its metadata atomically with updates
made to Ext3 metadata.

Both of these reasons touch the core architectural decisions of systems
like Coda/AFS/InterMezzo/DCE-DFS -- so there is some historical reason to
be so delighted with what one can do with Stephen's API.

Presently, systems like Coda and AFS have a hell of a time keeping caches
in sync with the metadata and to a large extent Coda's really bad
performance is caused by this (an external transaction system is used in
conjunction with synchronous operations on the disk file system, ouch...).
InterMezzo will start using the kernel journal facility that should be
much lighter weight.

Is this a reasonable thing to ask for?

- Peter -

--
Get Linux (http://www.kernel.org) plus ReiserFS
 (http://devlinux.org/namesys).  If you sell an OS or
internet appliance, buy a port of ReiserFS!  If you
need customizations and industrial grade support, we sell them.

--
To unsubscribe, send a message with 'unsubscribe linux-mm' in
the body to majordomo@kvack.org.  For more info on Linux MM,
see: http://www.nl.linux.org/Linux-MM/