From: Gerhard Pircher <hidden> Date: 2007-11-13 21:48:46
I'm trying to debug a kernel lockup that occurs on my machine with all kernel
versions >2.6.16. I don't have a clue what the root cause of this lockup is,
thus I'm thinking about using a hardware debugger. Can anybody recommend a
reasonably cheap hardware debugger that works with G4 CPUs and can interact
with GDB/DDD?
regards,
Gerhard
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From: Grant Likely <hidden> Date: 2007-11-13 21:57:22
On 11/13/07, Gerhard Pircher [off-list ref] wrote:
I'm trying to debug a kernel lockup that occurs on my machine with all kernel
versions >2.6.16. I don't have a clue what the root cause of this lockup is,
thus I'm thinking about using a hardware debugger. Can anybody recommend a
reasonably cheap hardware debugger that works with G4 CPUs and can interact
with GDB/DDD?
From: Grant Likely <hidden> Date: 2007-11-13 21:59:24
On 11/13/07, Grant Likely [off-list ref] wrote:
On 11/13/07, Gerhard Pircher [off-list ref] wrote:
quoted
I'm trying to debug a kernel lockup that occurs on my machine with all kernel
versions >2.6.16. I don't have a clue what the root cause of this lockup is,
thus I'm thinking about using a hardware debugger. Can anybody recommend a
reasonably cheap hardware debugger that works with G4 CPUs and can interact
with GDB/DDD?
Abatron BDI-2000.
Oops, but that's not all that cheap. ($2750USD). You might try
looking at the Macraigor Wiggler
(http://www.macraigor.com/wiggler.htm), but it has limited powerpc
support.
Cheers,
g.
--
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Secret Lab Technologies Ltd.
grant.likely@secretlab.ca
(403) 399-0195
From: Jon Smirl <hidden> Date: 2007-11-13 22:03:41
On 11/13/07, Grant Likely [off-list ref] wrote:
On 11/13/07, Gerhard Pircher [off-list ref] wrote:
quoted
I'm trying to debug a kernel lockup that occurs on my machine with all kernel
versions >2.6.16. I don't have a clue what the root cause of this lockup is,
thus I'm thinking about using a hardware debugger. Can anybody recommend a
reasonably cheap hardware debugger that works with G4 CPUs and can interact
with GDB/DDD?
Abatron BDI-2000.
Does anyone have the detailed doc needed to implement the software for
a PPC hardware debugger? Dominic, the author of OpenOCD, has said he
will take a look at adding PPC support if someone can supply him with
the right doc.
I've requested it from my Freescale rep. They sent me all of the
hardware info but none of the software info. They can't seem to figure
out what I'm asking for.
--
Jon Smirl
jonsmirl@gmail.com
From: Jon Smirl <hidden> Date: 2007-11-13 22:10:33
On 11/13/07, Grant Likely [off-list ref] wrote:
On 11/13/07, Grant Likely [off-list ref] wrote:
quoted
On 11/13/07, Gerhard Pircher [off-list ref] wrote:
quoted
I'm trying to debug a kernel lockup that occurs on my machine with all kernel
versions >2.6.16. I don't have a clue what the root cause of this lockup is,
thus I'm thinking about using a hardware debugger. Can anybody recommend a
reasonably cheap hardware debugger that works with G4 CPUs and can interact
with GDB/DDD?
Abatron BDI-2000.
Oops, but that's not all that cheap. ($2750USD). You might try
looking at the Macraigor Wiggler
(http://www.macraigor.com/wiggler.htm), but it has limited powerpc
support.
Oops, but that's not all that cheap. ($2750USD). You might try
looking at the Macraigor Wiggler
(http://www.macraigor.com/wiggler.htm), but it has limited powerpc
support.
Looks like the Abatron BDI-2000 is the cheapest hardware debugger that
supports 74xx G4 CPUs. :-(
Thanks!
Gerhard
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From: Dan Malek <hidden> Date: 2007-11-13 23:32:51
On Nov 13, 2007, at 1:59 PM, Grant Likely wrote:
quoted
Abatron BDI-2000.
Oops, but that's not all that cheap. ($2750USD).
If you place any value on your time or development
schedule, it's a bargain. Just plug it in, and it works.
Choose any of your favorite debugger front ends,
from none with just a telnet interface, to remote gdb,
ddd, or several Eclipse options. Several choices
of host OS. It will pay you back in development and
debugging time savings over and over.
-- Dan
From: Olof Johansson <hidden> Date: 2007-11-13 23:38:15
On Tue, Nov 13, 2007 at 03:23:29PM -0800, Dan Malek wrote:
On Nov 13, 2007, at 1:59 PM, Grant Likely wrote:
quoted
quoted
Abatron BDI-2000.
Oops, but that's not all that cheap. ($2750USD).
If you place any value on your time or development
schedule, it's a bargain.
That only applies for cases where time means money, i.e. professional
work. Spending three thousand dollars to debug a board that you spent
a few hundred dollars buying just for a hobby is pretty crazy.
-Olof
From: Jon Smirl <hidden> Date: 2007-11-13 23:53:46
On 11/13/07, Olof Johansson [off-list ref] wrote:
On Tue, Nov 13, 2007 at 03:23:29PM -0800, Dan Malek wrote:
quoted
On Nov 13, 2007, at 1:59 PM, Grant Likely wrote:
quoted
quoted
Abatron BDI-2000.
Oops, but that's not all that cheap. ($2750USD).
If you place any value on your time or development
schedule, it's a bargain.
That only applies for cases where time means money, i.e. professional
work. Spending three thousand dollars to debug a board that you spent
a few hundred dollars buying just for a hobby is pretty crazy.
That's why Dominic wants to get OpenOCD running on the PowerPC. All we
need is the programming documentation for controlling the CPU via the
debug hardware.
Obviously this documentation exist, all of the commercial vendors had
to have it to develop their debuggers. Maybe it is already out there
and we just don't know where to look.
--
Jon Smirl
jonsmirl@gmail.com
Oops, but that's not all that cheap. ($2750USD). You might try
looking at the Macraigor Wiggler
(http://www.macraigor.com/wiggler.htm), but it has limited powerpc
support.
From: Benjamin Herrenschmidt <benh@kernel.crashing.org> Date: 2007-11-14 01:18:10
That's why Dominic wants to get OpenOCD running on the PowerPC. All we
need is the programming documentation for controlling the CPU via the
debug hardware.
Note that this is basically different for every CPU around.
Obviously this documentation exist, all of the commercial vendors had
to have it to develop their debuggers. Maybe it is already out there
and we just don't know where to look.
From: Jon Smirl <hidden> Date: 2007-11-14 01:32:58
On 11/13/07, Benjamin Herrenschmidt [off-list ref] wrote:
quoted
That's why Dominic wants to get OpenOCD running on the PowerPC. All we
need is the programming documentation for controlling the CPU via the
debug hardware.
Note that this is basically different for every CPU around.
I'd like to get it for the MPC5200 because of the project I am working
on, an open source audio device. It would be nice if there was a cheap
hardware debugger available for hackers to use on it. Maybe one of the
Freescale developers will see this and send me the right docs.
Is it radically different? Dominic has been able to support every ARM
7/9 chip he can get his hands on without too much trouble once the
core support was written. I don't think he has ARM 11 working yet.
quoted
Obviously this documentation exist, all of the commercial vendors had
to have it to develop their debuggers. Maybe it is already out there
and we just don't know where to look.
Looks like the Abatron BDI-2000 is the cheapest hardware debugger that
supports 74xx G4 CPUs. :-(
Do you have the appropriate connector for it on the motherboard as
well ? If not, then you are out of luck...
Ben.
Yes, the connector is on the CPU module.
Gerhard
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From: Jerry Van Baren <hidden> Date: 2007-11-15 01:33:39
Jon Smirl wrote:
On 11/13/07, Benjamin Herrenschmidt [off-list ref] wrote:
quoted
quoted
That's why Dominic wants to get OpenOCD running on the PowerPC. All we
need is the programming documentation for controlling the CPU via the
debug hardware.
Note that this is basically different for every CPU around.
I'd like to get it for the MPC5200 because of the project I am working
on, an open source audio device. It would be nice if there was a cheap
hardware debugger available for hackers to use on it. Maybe one of the
Freescale developers will see this and send me the right docs.
Is it radically different? Dominic has been able to support every ARM
7/9 chip he can get his hands on without too much trouble once the
core support was written. I don't think he has ARM 11 working yet.
quoted
quoted
Obviously this documentation exist, all of the commercial vendors had
to have it to develop their debuggers. Maybe it is already out there
and we just don't know where to look.
Ben.
DISCLAIMER: Extrapolating grossly from almost no knowledge!
My understanding is that the Freescale PPC debugger interface is based
on the JTAG interface using a proprietary command set. Basically, if
you do their magic BDM (JTAG extension) command, you get into an
internal scan chain that allows you to read/write the processor
internals (registers).
The problems are many...
* The documentation is only available under NDA, a problem for open
source debuggers.
* The scan chain is different on every processor, and may be different
on different revisions of the same processor.
* If you mess up with JTAG, you will probably burn up the CPU. Very
literally. I've seen it done. Twice. (Thankfully not my screwup, and
it wasn't a PPC so it deserved to die. ;-) The internal scan chain is
probably safer, but YMMV.
gvb
From: Jon Smirl <hidden> Date: 2007-11-15 02:34:47
On 11/14/07, Jerry Van Baren [off-list ref] wrote:
Jon Smirl wrote:
quoted
On 11/13/07, Benjamin Herrenschmidt [off-list ref] wrote:
quoted
quoted
That's why Dominic wants to get OpenOCD running on the PowerPC. All we
need is the programming documentation for controlling the CPU via the
debug hardware.
Note that this is basically different for every CPU around.
I'd like to get it for the MPC5200 because of the project I am working
on, an open source audio device. It would be nice if there was a cheap
hardware debugger available for hackers to use on it. Maybe one of the
Freescale developers will see this and send me the right docs.
Is it radically different? Dominic has been able to support every ARM
7/9 chip he can get his hands on without too much trouble once the
core support was written. I don't think he has ARM 11 working yet.
quoted
quoted
Obviously this documentation exist, all of the commercial vendors had
to have it to develop their debuggers. Maybe it is already out there
and we just don't know where to look.
Ben.
DISCLAIMER: Extrapolating grossly from almost no knowledge!
My understanding is that the Freescale PPC debugger interface is based
on the JTAG interface using a proprietary command set. Basically, if
you do their magic BDM (JTAG extension) command, you get into an
internal scan chain that allows you to read/write the processor
internals (registers).
The problems are many...
* The documentation is only available under NDA, a problem for open
source debuggers.
This is what we need. I would like it specifically for the mpc5200.
But we want to use it in OpenOCD so NDA won't work.
* The scan chain is different on every processor, and may be different
on different revisions of the same processor.
Hopefully the doc will cover this.
* If you mess up with JTAG, you will probably burn up the CPU. Very
literally. I've seen it done. Twice. (Thankfully not my screwup, and
it wasn't a PPC so it deserved to die. ;-) The internal scan chain is
probably safer, but YMMV.
Dominic is way experienced implementing JTAG for ARM CPUs. He has done
several dozen interfaces. ARM doesn't have any problems releasing
their debugging info.
I've also lined up a mpc5200 development board vendor who wants a
cheap mpc5200 JTAG too and is willing to supply him with target
hardware.
JTAG hardware would be something similar to this:
http://www.amontec.com/jtagkey-tiny.shtml
So $30-40 for hardware with free OpenOCD software and you have JTAG
for the mpc5200.
This puts it in the range of classroom use.
The few embedded classes I've been around lately are being taught on
ARM hardware because it is so cheap. Development boards and the JTAG
can be had for under $100.
For example check out this store, it carries hundreds of ARM products
and almost no PowerPC ones.
http://microcontrollershop.com
--
Jon Smirl
jonsmirl@gmail.com