Re: ANNOUNCE: Git Forum

I might be interested in this, but why the web forum format?  Why not
just set up a git-users mailing list instead?  Archive it on the web if
you want, but a mailing list is more suited to this kind of thing.. or
better yet a newsgroup.  I usually read my mailing lists through gmane's
NNTP server anyway (like this one).

I think some people just like the web forum format. It allows topics
to be easily sorted and you can even go back and edit posts to update
old posts. It just seems easier to use for some. The forum would allow
users to easily communicate and I think a lot of users not only look
at mailing lists but also seek out forums for help. Dylan.

On Tue, Apr 08, 2008 at 03:51:59PM -0600, Dill [off-list ref] wrote:

I think a lot of users not only look at mailing lists but also seek
out forums for help.

i never understood why this is good. maybe because there are no ads on
this mailing list?

yes, there are users who can't use a mail client so they use forums, but
how one expects a user to learn git when he/she is not able to use a
mail client? :)

I just think it's handy for variety. Doesn't hurt to have multiple
sources of info. Yes someone could search this mailing list but a
forum is useful as well. Just different.
ohh and gitforum.net should work now

 > I think a lot of users not only look at mailing lists but also seek
 > out forums for help.

 i never understood why this is good. maybe because there are no ads on
 this mailing list?

 yes, there are users who can't use a mail client so they use forums, but
 how one expects a user to learn git when he/she is not able to use a
 mail client? :)

On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 7:25 PM, Miklos Vajna [off-list ref] wrote:

On Tue, Apr 08, 2008 at 03:51:59PM -0600, Dill [off-list ref] wrote:
 > I think a lot of users not only look at mailing lists but also seek
 > out forums for help.

 i never understood why this is good. maybe because there are no ads on
 this mailing list?

 yes, there are users who can't use a mail client so they use forums, but
 how one expects a user to learn git when he/she is not able to use a
 mail client? :)

Specially with gmane and their ilk, which provide forum-like views,
including ads ;-)

One thing we have had discussions about in the past is that we don't
want to split users from developers. Developers are here, so let's
make sure users are guided here too. The approach of not splitting
user/dev lists is a very good one - even if controversial at times.

Make sure you read up on earlier discussions on a "git-users" list -
most of the considerations that apply against it also apply against a
forum.

cheers,



m
-- 
 martin.langhoff@gmail.com
 martin@laptop.org -- School Server Architect
 - ask interesting questions
 - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first
 - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff

On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 4:36 PM, Martin Langhoff
[off-list ref] wrote:

On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 7:25 PM, Miklos Vajna [off-list ref] wrote:
 > On Tue, Apr 08, 2008 at 03:51:59PM -0600, Dill [off-list ref] wrote:
 >  > I think a lot of users not only look at mailing lists but also seek
 >  > out forums for help.
 >
 >  i never understood why this is good. maybe because there are no ads on
 >  this mailing list?
 >
 >  yes, there are users who can't use a mail client so they use forums, but
 >  how one expects a user to learn git when he/she is not able to use a
 >  mail client? :)

 Specially with gmane and their ilk, which provide forum-like views,
 including ads ;-)

 One thing we have had discussions about in the past is that we don't
 want to split users from developers. Developers are here, so let's
 make sure users are guided here too. The approach of not splitting
 user/dev lists is a very good one - even if controversial at times.

 Make sure you read up on earlier discussions on a "git-users" list -
 most of the considerations that apply against it also apply against a
 forum.

 cheers,

I have but as git grows more popular so will the users who wish to
create communities that can help each other. IMHO this list will
probably tend to be about development and bugs etc while other sites
will sprout up geared more towards users. Could be wrong though.
Dylan.

On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 7:45 PM, Dill [off-list ref] wrote:

 I have but as git grows more popular so will the users who wish to
 create communities that can help each other. IMHO this list will
 probably tend to be about development and bugs etc while other sites
 will sprout up geared more towards users. Could be wrong though.

Do read the older discussions. Separating users from developers does
not work well. Successful communities have mixed lists -- perhaps
split by topic (linux-usb for example) but not by "participant type".
Users should be guided towards this list --

cheers,



m
-- 
 martin.langhoff@gmail.com
 martin@laptop.org -- School Server Architect
 - ask interesting questions
 - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first
 - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff

Dill [off-list ref] writes:

On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 4:36 PM, Martin Langhoff
[off-list ref] wrote:

quoted

On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 7:25 PM, Miklos Vajna [off-list ref] wrote:

quoted

On Tue, Apr 08, 2008 at 03:51:59PM -0600, Dill [off-list ref] wrote:

quoted

I think a lot of users not only look at mailing lists but also seek
out forums for help.

i never understood why this is good. maybe because there are no ads on
this mailing list?

yes, there are users who can't use a mail client so they use forums, but
how one expects a user to learn git when he/she is not able to use a
mail client? :)

 Specially with gmane and their ilk, which provide forum-like views,
 including ads ;-)

 One thing we have had discussions about in the past is that we don't
 want to split users from developers. Developers are here, so let's
 make sure users are guided here too. The approach of not splitting
 user/dev lists is a very good one - even if controversial at times.

 Make sure you read up on earlier discussions on a "git-users" list -
 most of the considerations that apply against it also apply against a
 forum.

I have but as git grows more popular so will the users who wish to
create communities that can help each other. IMHO this list will
probably tend to be about development and bugs etc while other sites
will sprout up geared more towards users. Could be wrong though.

First, Git is and I think would be mainly developers tool.  Developers
should know how to use mailing list, either using mail client
(subscribing or not) or news reader (via GMane NNTP interface).

Second, there are many ways to read git mailing list (various mailing
list archives, NNTP interface, IIRC also RSS interface).

Third, we have #git channel on FreeNode for quick response (if
possible), we have Git Homepage (and maintainer welcomes patches; the
git homepage itself is maintained using git), we have Git Wiki where
one can find and put information (contribute!)...

Do we really need web forum?

-- 
Jakub Narebski
Poland
ShadeHawk on #git

El 9/4/2008, a las 0:32, Dill escribió:

I just think it's handy for variety. Doesn't hurt to have multiple
sources of info. Yes someone could search this mailing list but a
forum is useful as well. Just different.
ohh and gitforum.net should work now

Just out of interest, who'll be receiving the income (if any) from the  
massive Google AdWords blocks at the top of every single page? (I'm  
guessing the providers of the free forum hosting.)

Wincent

On 2008-04-08, Martin Langhoff [off-list ref] wrote:

On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 7:45 PM, Dill [off-list ref] wrote:

quoted

 I have but as git grows more popular so will the users who wish to
 create communities that can help each other. IMHO this list will
 probably tend to be about development and bugs etc while other sites
 will sprout up geared more towards users. Could be wrong though.

Do read the older discussions. Separating users from developers does
not work well. Successful communities have mixed lists -- perhaps
split by topic (linux-usb for example) but not by "participant type".
Users should be guided towards this list --

I don't think this is right.

Debian has debian-user, debian-devel, and a host of other lists.  Some
are mixed (debian-kde), some aren't (debian-devel).  

debian-user is extremely high volume.  In fact, its volume normally
dwarfs that of debian-devel.  As a developer, it would be virtually
impossible to participate in development discussions without having to
spend an inordinate amount of time each day filtering out all the
discussions about KDE icons or whatnot.  

Not that these are *bad* discussions, or that developers never
subscribe to -user, but there are some developers (such as myself)
with limited time to devote to the project, and I feel my time is
better spent on development than on filtering through 1000 messages
each day that I'm not really interested in.

Moreover, as a *user* of some projects, I appreciate the distinction
as well.  I do not want to be a pest to the developers that are
donating their time to improve the project I benefit from when my
question could be perfectly well addressed by other users more
experienced than I.

As an example, I subscribe to the MythTV user list but not the
development list.  There are all sorts of discussions there --
everything from what TVs are best in different situations to
discussions over cable company encryption and setup of the MythTV web
interface.  I don't read most of them, but find some interesting.  At
the same time, I am not really interested in the latest SVN commits
for MythTV.  I upgrade my box maybe once a year and don't really care
about development internals, so as a user, this separation benefits me
too.

I don't see a -user list as a bad thing for a community the size of
Git.

Think about it this way: once the Windows stuff for Git gets mature
(to the TortoiseGit level), there are going to be a lot of people
using Git that really *can't* operate a mail client because the only
"mail client" at their disposal is Outlook.

-- John

Hi,

On Fri, 11 Apr 2008, John Goerzen wrote:

Think about it this way: once the Windows stuff for Git gets mature (to 
the TortoiseGit level), there are going to be a lot of people using Git 
that really *can't* operate a mail client because the only "mail client" 
at their disposal is Outlook.

That's a scary thought.  I will stop all my work on git-cheetah.

Ciao,
Dscho